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High Octane, enjoy while you can!

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Old Jun 10, 2010 | 04:54 PM
  #1  
Calgarywinger's Avatar
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High Octane, enjoy while you can!

I'm not sure if this is Canada-wide or only here in Alberta but the law was changed so that all gasolines must have 10% Ethanol. Up to now it was only Mohawk and I think Husky which had Ethanol blends.
So how does this affect your car?
Adding Ethanol to gasoline boosts the octane higher, this wasn't noticeable with Mohawk and/or Husky because the refinery adjusts the minimum octane accordingly. In other words, the refiner would only add enough Aromatics to meet the mandated octane rating including 10% Ethanol.
Example: Mohawk would produce Regular gas at 80 + 2 for the Ethanol = total of 82.
Because of the new regulation, refiners must add Ethanol to existing stocks of gas which means that until the processing and storage catches up all brands will have the added Ethanol octane boost.
If you notice your car acting as if it's on steroids you'll know why.
How long will this last?
Word is, around here (Calgary), that most refineries will make the changes (refined at 80 without Ethane) by the end of this year.
Enjoy while you can
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Old Jun 11, 2010 | 01:31 AM
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Ethanol is not good...
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Old Jun 11, 2010 | 10:51 AM
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From: Jew York
Basically all the gas in NY (maybe the whole US?) has up to 10% ethanol in it. There are warning labels on the gas pumps about it.
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Old Jun 11, 2010 | 10:54 AM
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Further info on E5

Earlier I wasn't sure if this affected only Alberta or all provinces but I found out that each province will have a different percentage of ethanol.
The minimum is 5%, some provinces are legislating 7% and some will be at 10%.

Canadian E5 mandate to move ahead despite concerns
<o></o>
Despite growing concerns that the widespread production and use of corn ethanol is actually counter-productive to reducing greenhouse gas emissions, the Canadian government is moving ahead with a mandate to require ethanol blending into all gasoline supplies. By September 2010, Canadian refiners will be required to have at least 5-percent ethanol content in all pump gas. The regulation has received cabinet approval, and if it proceeds, would require nearly half a billion gallons of ethanol annually for blending.

As far as Infiniti is concerned, 10% oxygenated fuels is OK:

Gasoline containing oxygenates<o></o>
<o></o>
Some fuel suppliers sell gasoline containing<o></o>
oxygenates such as ethanol, MTBE and methanol<o></o>
with or without advertising their presence.<o></o>
INFINITI does not recommend the use of fuels of<o></o>
which the oxygenate content and the fuel compatibility<o></o>
for your INFINITI cannot be readily<o></o>
determined. If in doubt, ask your service station<o></o>
manager.<o></o>
If you use oxygenate-blend gasoline, please<o></o>
take the following precautions as the usage of<o></o>
such fuels may cause vehicle performance problems<o></o>
and/or fuel system damage.<o></o>
The fuel should be unleaded and have an octane<o></o>
rating no lower than that recommended<o></o>
for unleaded gasoline.<o></o>
If an oxygenate-blend, excepting a methanol<o></o>
blend, is used, it should contain no more than<o></o>
10% oxygenate. (MTBE may, however, be<o></o>
added up to 15%.)<o></o>
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Old Jun 12, 2010 | 10:58 AM
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ethanol has been in gas for a long time... all the gas stations here (ontario) have labels which state the minimum ethanol content you that is put into the gas.

also ethanol actually has less energy, it's "fake" high octane.
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Old Jun 12, 2010 | 11:22 PM
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So this marks the end of Shell V-Power 0% ethanol gas in Ontario?
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Old Jun 13, 2010 | 08:24 PM
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we had them here in vancouver for months already. for 91 octane only shell v-power has no ethanol. otherwise get 94octane for theo ther brands for no ethanol.
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Old Jun 14, 2010 | 07:52 PM
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From: Colorado
Originally Posted by bacid
ethanol has been in gas for a long time... all the gas stations here (ontario) have labels which state the minimum ethanol content you that is put into the gas.

also ethanol actually has less energy, it's "fake" high octane.
Not really. I ran it in my Subaru for more power. Here's an excerpt from E85 fuel FAQ - NASIOC which explains the energy issues.

Power available on E85

Many sources make a big deal about E85 having less thermal energy per gallon that a gallon of gas. They frequently draw the false conclusion that you cannot make more power on E85 than you can on gasoline. E85 actually has a higher specific energy at stoichiometric fuel air mixtures than gasoline, and at proper max power mixtures releases more thermal energy in the cylinder for a given amount of air to burn. Since an internal combustion engines power output is primarily air supply limited this means you can make 5% to nearly 30% more power on E85 than you can on gasoline.

(edit 6/10/08) Current experience shows turbocharged cars like the WRX and DSM families can run upwards of 30 psi boost on E85 tunes without knock. The only case I know of where knock was logged was on a 500+ whp DSM running 35-39 psi boost!

Ethanol specific energy at stoichiometric fuel air mixtures is actually higher than gasoline allowing a higher release of energy per lb of air burned than gasoline.

Typical gasoline Thermal energy 19,000 BTU/lb max power fuel air mixture 12.5:1
Typical E85 Thermal energy 13,475 BTU/lb max power fuel air mixture 6.975:1
Typical ethanol Thermal energy 12,500 BTU/lb 6.429:1

If you are consuming 100 lbs of air, lets see how much fuel energy you release for each of these fuels using gasoline as the base 100% reference.
100/12.5 = 8 lbs of gasoline @ 19,000 BTU/lb = 152,000 BTU = 100%
100/6.975 = 14.337 lbs of E85 @ 13,475 BTU/lb = 193,189.9 BTU = 127% more heat energy
100/6.429 = 15.555 lbs of Ethanol @ 12,500 BTU/lb = 194431.5 BTU = 128.9% more heat energy

Typical fuel energy contents:
gallon of gasoline = 125,000 Btu
1 gallon of ethanol = 84,400 Btu
1 gallon methanol = 62,800 Btu
1 gallon of gasohol
(10% ethanol, 90% gasoline) = 120,900 Btu
1 gallon of E-85
(85% ethanol, 15% gasoline) = 90,500 Btu
1 gallon of kerosene or light distillate oil = 135,000 Btu
1 gallon of middle distillate or diesel fuel oil = 138,690 Btu


My long term average on gasoline was 24 mpg, my mileage on the same setup on E85 was 22 mpg, my current mileage on gasoline is about 22 current mileage on E85 is 18 mpg.

Current setup upgraded turbo-
gasoline mileage 22 mpg = 5682 BTU/mi
E85 90,500 Btu /gallon / 18 mpg = 5028 BTU/mile (daily driving with periodic high boost acceleration)
E85 90,500 BTU/gallon/ 19.3 mpg = 4689 BTU/mile (driving mostly off boost as daily commuter)

Old setup stock turbo -
gasoline mileage Gasoline 125,000 Btu/ gallon / 24 = 5208 BTU/mile
My old setup, @ 92% of gasoline milage or 22 mpg
E85 90,500 BTU/gallon/22 = 4114 BTU/mile

A 5% increase in engine power is common on NA engines with minimal conversion changes, and much higher numbers are possible if compression or boost is used to take advantage of E85's higher fuel octane.
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Old Jun 15, 2010 | 10:27 AM
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Well said Pip.
The point of my thread was that until the refineries catch up, the gas we buy today, here in Alberta, has a higher octane rating, and I noticed the difference the first time I filled up.
This would not be evident in other areas (States &/or Provinces) where ethanol has been used for a while as their refineries have had time to adjust the blends and end up with the mandated minimal octane ratings.
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Old Jun 15, 2010 | 10:58 PM
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From: Colorado
Originally Posted by Calgarywinger
Well said Pip.
The point of my thread was that until the refineries catch up, the gas we buy today, here in Alberta, has a higher octane rating, and I noticed the difference the first time I filled up.
This would not be evident in other areas (States &/or Provinces) where ethanol has been used for a while as their refineries have had time to adjust the blends and end up with the mandated minimal octane ratings.
I had around a 30whp gain on my subie when tuned for E85. The gas mileage took a nosedive, but the power gain was substantial.
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Old Jun 17, 2010 | 12:02 AM
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i bite my tongue!

learned something new today. thanks.
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Old Jun 24, 2010 | 07:46 PM
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From: your moms room watching TV
I am not sure why everyone is so scared of ethanol . I ran Shell V power in my car and it detonated like crazy no matter what i did, my tuner recommend i switch to Mowhawk ethanol...no more det. It will lean your AFR out 0.2-0.3 but it helps with detonation so that makes up for the amount it leans things out and i doubt anyone here is tuned that close to the ragged edge that it would even effect them.
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