PC 7424XP or Flex XC3401 VG?
04-02-2011, 12:29 PM
#1
PC 7424XP or Flex XC3401 VG?
I'm buying a bunch of detailing ish for my car this spring and plan on detailing some other people's car...(hopefully) in hopes of making a profit. I wanted to know what was better to use, the PC or the Flex and why. The PC is on sale right now on DI and the Flex is almost $200 more, so why should I pony up for the flex? It's my first time ever detailing using a buffer, so I want the right guidance, thanks.
Also, I plan on getting these materials from DI:
(I already have soap/shampoo/degreaser/microfiber drying towel)
~Grit Guard Insert
~DI White Bucket
~Foam Gun
~Poorboys World Spray and Wipe (Do I need this for my clay bar??)
~Gentle Fine Grade Clay 200ml
~CURRENTLY: Flex XC3401
~Meguiars Ultra Cut Compound M105
~Meguiars Ultra Finishing Polish M205
~(I NEED HELP PICKING OUT PADS FOR POLISH/WAX/GLAZE/SEALANT!)
~Chemical Guys EZ-Creme Glaze
~(Any help with a sealant???)
~Dodo Supernatural Wax (This is expensive as shiet.. should I buy it?)
~Chemical Guys Silk Shine Dressing/Protectant
~Microfiber towels/Masking Tape
I currently have a OB Coupe 2008 and it has a good amount of swirls/scratches so I want to go ahead and do this right the first time. I messaged DI, but I wanted some input on some members on here on what I should go about doing... thanks
Also, I plan on getting these materials from DI:
(I already have soap/shampoo/degreaser/microfiber drying towel)
~Grit Guard Insert
~DI White Bucket
~Foam Gun
~Poorboys World Spray and Wipe (Do I need this for my clay bar??)
~Gentle Fine Grade Clay 200ml
~CURRENTLY: Flex XC3401
~Meguiars Ultra Cut Compound M105
~Meguiars Ultra Finishing Polish M205
~(I NEED HELP PICKING OUT PADS FOR POLISH/WAX/GLAZE/SEALANT!)
~Chemical Guys EZ-Creme Glaze
~(Any help with a sealant???)
~Dodo Supernatural Wax (This is expensive as shiet.. should I buy it?)
~Chemical Guys Silk Shine Dressing/Protectant
~Microfiber towels/Masking Tape
I currently have a OB Coupe 2008 and it has a good amount of swirls/scratches so I want to go ahead and do this right the first time. I messaged DI, but I wanted some input on some members on here on what I should go about doing... thanks
04-02-2011, 01:52 PM
#2
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PC - less power, easier to use, perfect for beginners or non-professional detailing
Flex - lots of power, easy to use but do require some skill to handle, more professional grade.
I have personally used both, started with the PC, upgraded to the Flex for a period of time to do pro details, then back to PC.
Flex - lots of power, easy to use but do require some skill to handle, more professional grade.
I have personally used both, started with the PC, upgraded to the Flex for a period of time to do pro details, then back to PC.
04-02-2011, 02:06 PM
#3
I've used both and the Flex is the better tool imo. It's lighter and has more power allowing it to cut through compound much quicker with less passes.
If you are just going to use it once every blue moon then you will be fine with the porter cable.
Otherwise if you plan on detailing on a regular basis i would recommend the Flex.
If you are just going to use it once every blue moon then you will be fine with the porter cable.
Otherwise if you plan on detailing on a regular basis i would recommend the Flex.
04-02-2011, 02:23 PM
#4
I've used both and the Flex is the better tool imo. It's lighter and has more power allowing it to cut through compound much quicker with less passes.
If you are just going to use it once every blue moon then you will be fine with the porter cable.
Otherwise if you plan on detailing on a regular basis i would recommend the Flex.
If you are just going to use it once every blue moon then you will be fine with the porter cable.
Otherwise if you plan on detailing on a regular basis i would recommend the Flex.
Otherwise, I'd just be doing my own. Is a sealant necessary if I'm applying a wax? No right --? Polish/Glaze/Wax. Is that Okay or should I do Polish/Glaze/Sealant/Wax? What pads are recommended with the Meguiars M105/M205?
04-02-2011, 02:59 PM
#6
Well depends if people want me to detail for them Otherwise, I'd just be doing my own.
Is a sealant necessary if I'm applying a wax? No right --? Polish/Glaze/Wax. Is that Okay or should I do Polish/Glaze/Sealant/Wax? What pads are recommended with the Meguiars M105/M205?
Otherwise, I'd just be doing my own. Is a sealant necessary if I'm applying a wax? No right --? Polish/Glaze/Wax. Is that Okay or should I do Polish/Glaze/Sealant/Wax? What pads are recommended with the Meguiars M105/M205?
Check out Menzerna's Powerlock Sealant. Leaves a slick surface that lasts ~6 months.
You should allow the sealant to fully cure for 24 hours before applying wax.
Imo the glaze is not necessary as all it does is fill in and hide the swirls that will reappear after a wash anyway
But if you did a good job compounding then you don't have to worry about swirls anyway.
If you have anymore question check out the detailing section on this forum...
George@detailedimage is a great sponsor who can answer any further questions you might have
GL!!!
04-02-2011, 03:47 PM
#7
If you are only buying one, get the Flex over the PC. It's a better overall machine that can do more. The PC certainly isn't bad, but the Flex is better and can do more correction more quickly. Later you may choose to have both, I do.
As far as products, If I were you and had no experience with detailing, I wouldn't spend the huge coin buying the dodo Juice Supernatural off the bat. Yes it's a fantastic product, but you should IMO do some details using less expensive products that give great results first before dropping that coin. You can buy a whole palette of good waxes for less than on Supernatural.
I also have BO. Here are some suggestions that I can guarantee you will give amazing results if you do a good job with them:
Polishes- I have always liked Menzerna and I still do, but the newer Meguiar's Pro polishes are outstanding. They require much less working time than the Menzerna and produce great results. IMO you should get all 3 of them - M95 compound, M105 cutting polish, M205 finishing polish. Use the M95 only for deep scratches or really bad areas on a yellow or orange pad. Since your car is black and you say it's in bad shape, use the M105 over the whole car on an orange or white pad. I find that it finished down better than I expected on black and there's not always a need to follow it up with a finishing polish. But you may have some haze if you have to use the orange pad so be prepared to use the M205 on a white pad to really make it pop.
Pads- Buy at least one or two yellow for those few times you'll need to get really aggressive. Buy several orange, at least 3 or 4 white, and a couple of black ones as as well. If you use a glaze or apply a sealant with the machine (I prefer and recommend doing it by hand) then use the black pads for this.
Glaze- The CG EX Creme glaze is excellent. So are PBW Black Hole, and the Blackfire Glaze. That being said I don't really use the glaze often anymore, it looks just as good for me to polish and just use a sealant and/or wax. AS was mentioned, it doesn't last and it doesn't fix imperfections, only hides them a little. Like an ugly chic wearing a lot of makeup.
Sealant- I've used an number of them from cheapo to expensive an for me personally on my black G, noting is better than Blackfire Wet Diamond. Period. Easy to use and shines like you wouldn't believe. Decent durability too.
Wax- Detailed Image has was on sale right now, get it while it's discounted. Please don not buy a full sized Dodo Juice Supernatural. For less than the price of the full sized Supernatural you are considering, you can buy PBW Natty's Blue (great stuff, don't let the cheap price fool you), Blackfire Midnight Sun (a bit pricey but looks great over the BWD sealant), Some CG Pete's '53 (What I'm currently using at the moment), and pick up a 1 oz sample pot of the Dodo Supernatural which is enough to wax the whole car several times. And still have change left over. You will be able to compare different ones each time you wax to see which you like better, although all of these are good. Please remember that a wax job is only as good as the polishing and prep that you do before hand. That's the difference between a detailer and a car washer. Great polishing can make some dollar store Turtle Wax look great, poor polishing will make the Supernatural look ho hum.
I have detailed my black G a lot and come a long way.
https://www.myg37.com/forums/b4-n-af...the-salon.html
PM me if you have any specific questions or want tips.
As far as products, If I were you and had no experience with detailing, I wouldn't spend the huge coin buying the dodo Juice Supernatural off the bat. Yes it's a fantastic product, but you should IMO do some details using less expensive products that give great results first before dropping that coin. You can buy a whole palette of good waxes for less than on Supernatural.
I also have BO. Here are some suggestions that I can guarantee you will give amazing results if you do a good job with them:
Polishes- I have always liked Menzerna and I still do, but the newer Meguiar's Pro polishes are outstanding. They require much less working time than the Menzerna and produce great results. IMO you should get all 3 of them - M95 compound, M105 cutting polish, M205 finishing polish. Use the M95 only for deep scratches or really bad areas on a yellow or orange pad. Since your car is black and you say it's in bad shape, use the M105 over the whole car on an orange or white pad. I find that it finished down better than I expected on black and there's not always a need to follow it up with a finishing polish. But you may have some haze if you have to use the orange pad so be prepared to use the M205 on a white pad to really make it pop.
Pads- Buy at least one or two yellow for those few times you'll need to get really aggressive. Buy several orange, at least 3 or 4 white, and a couple of black ones as as well. If you use a glaze or apply a sealant with the machine (I prefer and recommend doing it by hand) then use the black pads for this.
Glaze- The CG EX Creme glaze is excellent. So are PBW Black Hole, and the Blackfire Glaze. That being said I don't really use the glaze often anymore, it looks just as good for me to polish and just use a sealant and/or wax. AS was mentioned, it doesn't last and it doesn't fix imperfections, only hides them a little. Like an ugly chic wearing a lot of makeup.
Sealant- I've used an number of them from cheapo to expensive an for me personally on my black G, noting is better than Blackfire Wet Diamond. Period. Easy to use and shines like you wouldn't believe. Decent durability too.
Wax- Detailed Image has was on sale right now, get it while it's discounted. Please don not buy a full sized Dodo Juice Supernatural. For less than the price of the full sized Supernatural you are considering, you can buy PBW Natty's Blue (great stuff, don't let the cheap price fool you), Blackfire Midnight Sun (a bit pricey but looks great over the BWD sealant), Some CG Pete's '53 (What I'm currently using at the moment), and pick up a 1 oz sample pot of the Dodo Supernatural which is enough to wax the whole car several times. And still have change left over. You will be able to compare different ones each time you wax to see which you like better, although all of these are good. Please remember that a wax job is only as good as the polishing and prep that you do before hand. That's the difference between a detailer and a car washer. Great polishing can make some dollar store Turtle Wax look great, poor polishing will make the Supernatural look ho hum.
I have detailed my black G a lot and come a long way.
https://www.myg37.com/forums/b4-n-af...the-salon.html
PM me if you have any specific questions or want tips.
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04-02-2011, 05:48 PM
#8
I have a black obsidian g as well. I also have a PC, once im comfortable with it maybe ill upgrade. Generally, (if i dont need huge correction) i use P40 polish, non stick gloss magnifier, and jetseal (im a chemical guys guy). If i have lots of correcting to do, i use meguairs ultimate compound first. I usually do 3 coats of jetseal, coat the jet seal with one layer of dodo juice blue velvet, then a layer of dodo juice purple haze, i think think it looks great!
04-02-2011, 06:45 PM
#9
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I just ordered a Griot Garage 6" random orbital. It's 7 amps, 850 watt, comes with a backing plate and a counter weight (I believe) and can be found cheaper than the pc 7424xp.
Bottom-line pricing on Griot's Garage - 10765STDCRD at ToolTopia.com
Bottom-line pricing on Griot's Garage - 10765STDCRD at ToolTopia.com
04-02-2011, 06:54 PM
#10
We have a little buffer comparison chart to break down some of the differences. Both options are great and will help you do high quality work. I personally prefer the Flex XC 3401 VRG because of the extra power it has. It works in a polish faster and can remove more surface imperfections. However the Flex costs quite a bit more so that can be a factor as well. Lastly the Porter Cable 7424XP Random Orbital Buffer is on sale this month at Detailed Image - Premium Auto Detailing and Car Care Products for $114.44. Let us know if you have any other questions!
Poorboys World Spray and Wipe - You'll need some sort of clay lube and this is a great option
Pad Combinations
~Meguiars Ultra Cut Compound M105 - Orange Pad
~Meguiars Ultra Finishing Polish M205 - White Pad
~Chemical Guys EZ-Creme Glaze - Black Pad
~Blackfire Wet Diamond with Polycharger or Menzerna Power Lock Polymer Sealant - Blue Pad
Wax Hand Applied
~Dodo Supernatural Wax - Just went on sale exp 4/7, Looks stunning with remarkable clarity and gloss
Let me know if you have any questions.
Greg
Poorboys World Spray and Wipe - You'll need some sort of clay lube and this is a great option
Pad Combinations
~Meguiars Ultra Cut Compound M105 - Orange Pad
~Meguiars Ultra Finishing Polish M205 - White Pad
~Chemical Guys EZ-Creme Glaze - Black Pad
~Blackfire Wet Diamond with Polycharger or Menzerna Power Lock Polymer Sealant - Blue Pad
Wax Hand Applied
~Dodo Supernatural Wax - Just went on sale exp 4/7, Looks stunning with remarkable clarity and gloss
Let me know if you have any questions.
Greg
04-03-2011, 06:33 AM
#12
Registered User
Porter_Cable
Pros- the random orbital buffer is manufactured as a sanding machine, but can be adapted as a very safe polishing machine, as it lacks the power to burn paint. It is very easy to use and is ideal for very minor paint correction and the application of car care products
Cons- it lacks the power to produce the kinetic (or dynamic) friction required to breakdown the diminishing abrasives in polishes designed for hard clear coats and / or paint correction / renovation, although it could be used for this purpose utilizing 4-inch foam pads to increase surface friction / heat it is very time consuming
Alternative random orbital buffers – Groit’s 6-inch Orbital Polisher, VRG, Flex XC 3401, Bosch Gex -150 Turbo, Festool Rotex - RO125, Makita BO6040 Polisher (alternate between circular or dual-action modes)
Griot's Garage 6 inch Random Orbital PolisherA powerful 7 amp (850 watt) motor with low-end torque for low speed polishing for better results, a wider 5/16 - inch (8mm) diameter offset orbit for faster polishing With the Griot's Garage system, a safer and easier way to remove swirl marks, fine scratches, and apply a protective coating to your paint.
Flex XC 3401 VRG (7.5 Amp electric motor) would be the best option prior to stepping-up to a rotary polisher (Rotary 101, if you will); this tool was made for paint correction (used by EU car manufacturers, much like the Cyclo is in the for US production line paint correction) it is far superior in its paint correction abilities than a Porter Cable 7424XP (PC) however it will not make paint corrections as fast or as thoroughly as a rotary polisher.
Due to its forced rotation its more powerful yet totally safe, removes light to heavy swirls, applies polishes, glazes, sealants, waxes, etc and has the best balance of power and totally safe polishing
Like all tools there is a learning curve with it, so first gain experience on a paint surface that doesn’t matter i.e. a scrap panel, practice until you feel confident enough in its use and capabilities to use it on your own vehicle. The immediate future in automotive clear coat paint is something very similar to CeramiClear i.e. very hard.
The Flex has the ability to correct this type of hard paint, whereas a PC requires a quite a few passes to correct them, and also struggles to breakdown diminishing abrasives (something else that car care products are going over too) as it doesn't provide sufficient friction)
Pros- the random orbital buffer is manufactured as a sanding machine, but can be adapted as a very safe polishing machine, as it lacks the power to burn paint. It is very easy to use and is ideal for very minor paint correction and the application of car care products
Cons- it lacks the power to produce the kinetic (or dynamic) friction required to breakdown the diminishing abrasives in polishes designed for hard clear coats and / or paint correction / renovation, although it could be used for this purpose utilizing 4-inch foam pads to increase surface friction / heat it is very time consuming
Alternative random orbital buffers – Groit’s 6-inch Orbital Polisher, VRG, Flex XC 3401, Bosch Gex -150 Turbo, Festool Rotex - RO125, Makita BO6040 Polisher (alternate between circular or dual-action modes)
Griot's Garage 6 inch Random Orbital PolisherA powerful 7 amp (850 watt) motor with low-end torque for low speed polishing for better results, a wider 5/16 - inch (8mm) diameter offset orbit for faster polishing With the Griot's Garage system, a safer and easier way to remove swirl marks, fine scratches, and apply a protective coating to your paint.
Flex XC 3401 VRG (7.5 Amp electric motor) would be the best option prior to stepping-up to a rotary polisher (Rotary 101, if you will); this tool was made for paint correction (used by EU car manufacturers, much like the Cyclo is in the for US production line paint correction) it is far superior in its paint correction abilities than a Porter Cable 7424XP (PC) however it will not make paint corrections as fast or as thoroughly as a rotary polisher.
Due to its forced rotation its more powerful yet totally safe, removes light to heavy swirls, applies polishes, glazes, sealants, waxes, etc and has the best balance of power and totally safe polishing
Like all tools there is a learning curve with it, so first gain experience on a paint surface that doesn’t matter i.e. a scrap panel, practice until you feel confident enough in its use and capabilities to use it on your own vehicle. The immediate future in automotive clear coat paint is something very similar to CeramiClear i.e. very hard.
The Flex has the ability to correct this type of hard paint, whereas a PC requires a quite a few passes to correct them, and also struggles to breakdown diminishing abrasives (something else that car care products are going over too) as it doesn't provide sufficient friction)
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