sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

This morning while backing out, my car stalled. My first thought was that I released the clutch pedal too early so I started her back up again and boom, same thing happened. So I started her back up again and carefully began to release the clutch pedal and realized that as I was backing out, I only had pressure about half way down. The first half of the pedal had absolutely no pressure and so the catch point and everything was really off. I ended up parking the car and taking a different one to work since I knew something was wrong but don't really know where to begin with the diagnosis. Anyone have any thought? I was running late for work so I didn't get a chance to check the clutch fluid but aside from that, what could it be?

Thanks in advance.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

If you haven't experienced any clutch slippage prior to this (it's noticeable if you shift into a high gear at low speed, e.g 6th at about 30 mph) you most likely just need to bleed the fluid.

It's a PITA process on this car, it's quite finicky. Take a look in the reservoir. It'll probably be darker than it should (iced tea color or darker instead of clear) and have some black sediment in the bottom of the reservoir. Also note the level. If it's more than a little bit low check for any leaks.

To bleed it you need a helper and a lot of patience. Siphon or soak up all the dirty fluid form the reservoir. Wipe away as much of the sediment in the bottom as you can with as clean lint free cloth or paper towel. Fill with clean fluid. Replace the cap. Have your helper pump the pedal SLOWLY about 10 times, holding the pedal to the floor firmly on the last stroke and then crack open the bleeder valve PARTIALLY, just enough for it to flow. Don't open it fully. Let it bleed dirty fluid and bubbles until it slows down, not until it stops. Catch the fluid in a clear container so you can see it's condition. It will likely be dirty and have a lot of air bubbles. This is what you're bleeding out. Repeat the process over and over (pump pedal, hold pedal, open bleeder, flow out fluid and bubbles, close bleeder). You'll need to check the reservoir periodically and keep it filled, it's important to not let it take in any more air by running empty. During this process the pedal may get completely limp to the point that you have to raise it by hand. Be patient. Once the fluid you're getting out of the bleeder is clean and completely bubble free, you've properly bleed all of the old fluid and air out of the line. It may take a whole pint or more of fluid. Get 2 to be safe. Take your time and good luck.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the reply BB. I've been reading around on the forum and was wondering if it could also be a master/slave cylinder issue? I know where the master cylinder is located but where is the slave located for bleeding/replacement?

EDIT: also, what type of clutch fluid is recommended? Clutch fluid is the same as brake fluid right?

vqsmile

I hate to say it, but the clutch system does not normally require the addition of much fluid at all, since there is relatively little difference in actual movement between a new clutch and a worn clutch (i.e. it's not like your brakes!) . If you are significantly down on your fluid level and/or have gotten air introduced into your clutch hydraulics, then you undoubtedly have a leak going on somewhere, and it most likely will be the confounded slave cylinder. Not wishing ill on you here, just trying to give you an honest heads up. You can probably get it to function better (temporarily) by adding fluid and bleeding, but the leak that likely caused the problem will still be there and will return in short order. My advice is to start saving for a big repair bill in your near future.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

It could possibly be a MC or CSC issue. But it costs very little to bleed it and see if that corrects the problem. If it doesn't help or the problem comes back quickly, you didn't lose much money and you now are certain that the problem is with those parts. If simple bleeding does fix the issue, you've just saved yourself thousands in parts and labor on a repair you didn't need. To me it's a no brainer to try the simple cheap solution first before going the difficult and expensive route. All you stand to lose is $10 and an hour of your time.

Regular DOT 3 or DOT 4 brake fluid is what you need. The concentric slave cylinder isn't accessible without dropping the transmission of the G unfortunately. However you don't need to access the CSC to bleed fluid. The bleeder nipple is a small (8mm?) nipple on the hard line that runs into the transmission. It's accessed form underneath the car on the driver side. Follow the line between the tranny and the master. You should see it.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

Will definitely try bleeding first!

One more question about bleeding...is it possible to gravity bleed the system? I've bled systems in the past before and could not get all the air out but when I gravity bleed then I was able to. Has anyone successfully gravity bled the clutch system on the G before? Is it even possible?

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

I'm not sure, I haven't tried it. I've only bled it the way I described above.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

So this is so weird. I haven't had a chance to bleed the system yet but this morning when I went to take the car out for a test drive, the pedal felt better!! When I first started it felt a little spongy but after about 15 minutes, it felt perfect like the way it usually does.

Any thoughts as to what happened?

During the drive, I did the test: shifted to 6 gear at 30 mph and everything was good. Nothing popped out of gear and the ride was smooth.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

Popping out of gear isn't what you're looking for. Slippage is if the RPMs spike when you do it but the car speed doesn't increase commensurately.

If it's fine now that's good, but it could come back.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

So I should still bleed it to be safe right?

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

I would. I bleed both of mine at least yearly. 2 or 3 times on the coupe if I do a few track days.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

OMG, I am having such a hard time bleeding the system. All the dirty old fluid is out but I cannot build pressure on the clutch pedal. I must have a ton of air in the system that I can't get rid of.

When I do BB's method, hardly any fluid comes out and the reservoir does not go down. If I open the nipple, helper presses and holds the pedal, I close and repeat, I get a bit more pressure but not much. If I gravity bleed, I get a bit better pressure but after a while it stops dripping as well. What am I doing wrong here?

Prior to starting this morning, the pedal felt perfect and I've been at it for 4 hours and still can't get it right.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

Pump - hold - open - bleed - close - release. Make sure you are pumping with firm SLOW strokes (that's what she said! ). Don't open the nipple before pumping. Also, just open the nipple slightly and don't hold it open until all the pressure bleeds off. Also, make sure the reservoir cap is on while doing this.

sLADe781

iTrader: (1)

BB I don't know why but no fluid comes out after the first 2 times when I do this method. Not only that but the reservoir does not go down and the pedal never builds any resistance.

JSolo

iTrader: (14)

It may help to undo the Fork from the pedal and pump the MC directly. As BB points out, key is pumping it slowly. If you're still unable to build up pressure, then it's likely CSC time. To save future headaches, replace the MC at the same time.