No need to buy a gauge and spend a few hours to install it.

 

I honestly wouldn't worry about adding an additional wideband sesnor for monitoring. If tuners are using the oem location upstream sensor, then its more than good enough for us as the end user to use it as our gauge, especially for those of us who are NA.

 

So...
All the way back from 2003 VQs brought a wideband sensor. In fact you could technically connect a V1 version of AEM wideband controllers directly to one of your factory 2003-2006 G35/350z AF sensor and steal that reading however it would not fully work since the ECM would no longer see the reading causing a massive fuel dump.

AF sensors age and quality can be diagnosed with OBD systems to determine if they are ok. Factory WB sensors are not calibrated to 14.7, the engine pushes for 14.7(Stoichiometric) as much as possible for idling/emission purposes so technically if you were to install aftermarket WBs you would be seeing the same reading.

If you wanted to install extra sensors they would need to be around the same area as the OEM ones, lower might have different readings, post cat readings are useless being that the CATS will change this reading.

For turbo cars the rule of thumb is to find out what setup are you running. TT setups vs Single will need different setups when it comes to these sensors.
Back pressure pre turbo/s is the main issue with this. If you go with homemade kits that utilize the stock headers the AF sensor is in them and it would put them pre turbo. If you look at a GTR setup you'll see AFs are post turbo to provide the best reading.

If you still want to go down this route, properly, you'll need two WBs around the same area as the OEM ones, best would be close to the flange on your test pipes for easy welding and removing. You'll still be maybe wasting your time since a set of NEW AFs would remove improper reading AFs that you can monitor with cost effective software.

If you follow Frank @MotorvateDIY video on how to obtain the fastest logging of devices follow his video on the wired version of the MX OBD reader with Torque Pro application on a decently fast tablet and it will be very close to aftermarket units.

 

I really don't need to monitor the AFR, as my car is isn't tuned.
However, I was curious to see what the AFR is for different engine loads and temperatures.

Here is what I have seen so far:
At idle and low engine load it should be ~14.7 and during a wide open run, it should get into the low 12s to high 11s (rich), depending on outside temperature and coolant temp. AND when you lift off the throttle, it should be 20+ (lean)

Here is a mini-dash I am developing for the G37. It shows engine coolant temp (ECT), engine oil temp (EOT), air/fuel ratio (AFR) and engine oil pressure (EOP)
Everything except EOP is retrieved without doing any wiring, just plug into the OBD port.

EOP also doesn't need wires to run through the firewall as it uses a "bluetooth sensor server" I developed
nd only needs ignition and ground, which is easy to find next to the engine!

Here is a cold start:


I hope to have an update in the next few weeks as I am adding an additional 30+ items I found on the G37 CAN bus.

 

Care to elaborate?

No tuner should be using an upstream sensor to get wideband O2 data.... The location of the upstream and downstream O2 sensors on our car are way too close together if you have removed your factory cat.

Huh? They brought a wideband sensor? Where did they bring it, to a gunfight? BULL with all due respect I do not understand many of your posts, I'm very sorry. I can't understand your writing or your style sometimes. It hurts my head.

I have a 2010 Infiniti G37x sedan, not an 03-06 G35, so this is irrelevant and confusing.

I have never heard of a factory wideband that was so reliably accurate that you could completely forego the installation of an aftermarket quality AFR gauge like the AEM w/ Bosch O2 sensor.


Pre and post cat readings are essential. That’s why manufacturers place them there lol. But if you remove the cats and get a tune and tell the ECU to stop looking for pre/post info since there is no cat anymore…




Well, my car is not turbo. And I would venture to guess 90% of people on this form don’t have any FI setup either. So again, more useless info that is confusing me and anyone else just trying to figure out where a good place to put an aftermarket AEM wideband sensor.


Why two widebands, one for each Bank 1 & 2? Why not just put the one wideband further downstream on the Y-pipe collector where the 2-1 merge is before splitting back out into two pipes? That would be the best place to capture overall data, I think…


I checked him out and that stuff looks awesome/amazing but complicated and way above my head and also not a simple process. It also looks like a work in progress and nothing super easily accessible for average consumers just yet. But what do I know lol.

 

So correction 2005+ brought Bosch wideband A/F sensors.




After 2006 Infiniti/Nissan switched from Bosch to Denso



Then 2013 changed the connector. Where your confusion may lie is thinking a wideband sensor comes with an external unit like AEM. The car still utilizes 2 wideband sensors on each bank and the ECM is what interprets the reading.
So in other words if you can get applications like Torque and OBDfusion, these can give you the same reading an aftermarket wideband sensor would give you on their proprietary gauge.
from 2005 + all nissans and infinitis brought one wideband sensor per bank. Factory widebands need to be accurate for the sake of airfuels and tuning.

Being that your car already has two Denso wideband sensors already, Torque/OBD fusion/ Uprev/ECUTEK will give you those readings without the need of any wiring or install. If the factory sensors were unreliable we would see this info splayed over the internet left and right. You have to understand many folks including myself have gone into the flashing and tuning of these vehicles and there's just no need for one when we can monitor the factory ones.

Why 2 widebands instead of two? Having one wideband will tell you the overall Airfuel of both banks. No sense of downgrading to one sensor when you can read the two that the car already brings. incredibly efficient way of finding issues when you can concentrate on 3 cylinders(1 bank = 3 cyls) than on 6 and trying to find out which cylinder is running lean or rich.

If you install an aftermarket gauge it will very likely read the same as the original ones with the differences being in how lean or rich one bank is.
If one bank is reading 14.0 and the other is reading 15.3 you might end up with an overall reading of 14.7 however it means an unbalance in banks.

Most 4 cylinders bring only one sensor so most of your experience ends up falling short when it comes to this car, I stopped fighting the engineers a while back, after switching my mentality to as of WHY would they do it this way and speaking with other knowledgeable folks in the scene I learned that not all of these systems are for emission purposes and actually perform as long as the interpreter(driver/owner) knows how to interpret these.

Many times what might sound like criticism in the forums is money and headache saving advice. Once you learn how to read these properly you'll find how many posts and threads will suddenly start making sense.
Hope this helps.

 

Thanks for having a look... what you have seen are the development prototypes. They are an ugly but necessary step in product development.

The final version will be plug and play... If you can plug in an ELM327, you can install the gauges/mini-dash I am developing.

 

Thanks. I absolutely know "Factory widebands need to be accurate for the sake of airfuels and tuning".

No, no confusion there. This isn't my first rodeo. Whether it's a 4 cyl NA or turbo car, or a large V8 with an aftermarket supercharger. I know the difference between a factory wideband and an aftermarket unit kit with a gauge and a sensor i.e. what AEM sells.

What it sounds like is that it's a waste of time/money to put an aftermarket wideband O2 sensor kit running to a gauge installed in the cabin for our cars. Makes you wonder why Z1 would sell them lol. Then again...

Sounds like money for an AEM wideband kit is better spent on EcuTek tuning and then use your phone app (EcuTek) to read and display real-time wideband O2 data for each bank....

 

You are correct. At the same time most of these AEM kits are universal so you can guarantee that before any aftermarket support is even made for a vehicle you can count on AEM to have a WB kit ready for it even if it's not needed.

You can thank the forum for saving you $170.
We're here to help!

 

For our engines, all VQ, there’s no other oxygen sensor besides the upstream that’s used for AFR during tuning. It’s definitely not the narrow band downstream sensors since most people run defoulers or even have the tuner disable them because of the check engine light.

 

Generally speaking a post-cat o2 sensor is just there to monitor the cats efficiency, it’s for emissions. I’m sure there are exceptions to this but for the most part that’s what post-cat o2 sensors are for.

 

Haha thanks! I have the AEM kit in the garage. I'll sell it. I'm sure someone is out there with a car that doesn't have factory widebands lol

I think you have it backwards. Usually upstream = narrow band. The further downstream captures wide band.

I need to have a tune disable something because my CEL is on after I installed test pipes (no cats). Car going into the exhaust shop tomorrow. I want to puke every time I drive from the exhaust fumes being pumped in my face in the cabin. Must be gasket leaks.

 

Upstream are the wideband and will always be. They have to be pre cat(cat changes AFR mixtures) which is why the rears are Oxygen content detecting. To determined the efficiency of the catalitic converter. Your CEL is due to test pies and o2 extensions will have you running great again as long as there are no leaks in your exhaust.

 

Are you using a defouler/O2 spacer? it helps but its a hit or miss. I've been fortune with 3 different test pipes, I've never gotten a CEL.
Test pipes are known to give off fumes. Some prefer HFC becaues of this. But if there is a leak by the y pipe, test pipes, or header connections, it could make the fuse travel faster to you.

 

I beg to differ lol.

NARROWBAND VS. WIDEBAND O2 SENSORS