6MT: trouble shifting into first after driving for a long time
6MT: trouble shifting into first after driving for a long time
After driving for some time and coming to a complete stop (say at an intersection), I have trouble getting into first gear. The shifter feels blocked, as if it can't physically go anywhere. When this happens I go back to neutral, sometimes let off the clutch, press it down again, and then try again. The second attempt usually goes it with a little more resistance.
When the car is first started after having sat for many hours, it is fine. 1st and 2nd are a little clunky if anything.
My thoughts:
1. fluid issues (scheduled to replace next spring...)
This transmission was replaced under warranty in March 2013. It's had a fairly easy life, mostly highway driving, minimal grinding, 1 track outing. Assuming it was filled with the correct fluid and to the correct level when it was installed, not sure how it would go bad.
2. Shifter guide plate needs adjustment
I did this after the transmission was replaced, not sure how it would've moved. It's also curious how it only happens once the car has been driven for a while. I kind of thinking it is related to the transmission moving around too much ; perhaps the transmission mount warms up and goes soft, or maybe it is just not installed correctly?
Anyone else have this issue or thoughts on this issue?
When the car is first started after having sat for many hours, it is fine. 1st and 2nd are a little clunky if anything.
My thoughts:
1. fluid issues (scheduled to replace next spring...)
This transmission was replaced under warranty in March 2013. It's had a fairly easy life, mostly highway driving, minimal grinding, 1 track outing. Assuming it was filled with the correct fluid and to the correct level when it was installed, not sure how it would go bad.
2. Shifter guide plate needs adjustment
I did this after the transmission was replaced, not sure how it would've moved. It's also curious how it only happens once the car has been driven for a while. I kind of thinking it is related to the transmission moving around too much ; perhaps the transmission mount warms up and goes soft, or maybe it is just not installed correctly?
Anyone else have this issue or thoughts on this issue?
Last edited by Dough1397; Sep 2, 2014 at 10:22 AM.
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I don't think you have a problem. I've experienced this with mt's in different cars from time to time. It's to late to think why this happens, but as you've found out, double clutching while stopped allows the shifter to re-engage very easily.
Something about gears not meshing right when stopped is what comes to mind. On a motorcycle with a sequential gearbox a similar phenomenon can be experienced. If you come to a stop in 6th gear, you may be able to downshift to 5th or 4th, but not much further without moving the bike forward or back and letting the clutch out slightly for an instant.
Something about gears not meshing right when stopped is what comes to mind. On a motorcycle with a sequential gearbox a similar phenomenon can be experienced. If you come to a stop in 6th gear, you may be able to downshift to 5th or 4th, but not much further without moving the bike forward or back and letting the clutch out slightly for an instant.
How many miles do you have on the trans fluid. Lifetime fluid is the length of the factory warranty. Switch to motul if you have over 50k miles. While you're doing that change your diff fluid with motul as well.
I have problems shifting into 6th sometimes and it feels blocked. I just go back into 5th and try it again and it normally works . I had the dealer look at it and they didn't find anything so I'm following this thread.
I don't think you have a problem. I've experienced this with mt's in different cars from time to time. It's to late to think why this happens, but as you've found out, double clutching while stopped allows the shifter to re-engage very easily.
Something about gears not meshing right when stopped is what comes to mind. On a motorcycle with a sequential gearbox a similar phenomenon can be experienced. If you come to a stop in 6th gear, you may be able to downshift to 5th or 4th, but not much further without moving the bike forward or back and letting the clutch out slightly for an instant.
Something about gears not meshing right when stopped is what comes to mind. On a motorcycle with a sequential gearbox a similar phenomenon can be experienced. If you come to a stop in 6th gear, you may be able to downshift to 5th or 4th, but not much further without moving the bike forward or back and letting the clutch out slightly for an instant.
The transmission was replaced in March 2013, since then I've driven only 20k miles.
This was rubbing me the wrong way again yesterday. I did some more searching and found a couple threads (here and here) suggesting the input shaft needs lube on the spines where the clutch disc sits.
I tried visualizing this, I think I can see how a dry spline would cause the clutch disc to stick to the flywheel and thus cause the input shaft to continue to rotate (rather than slide away). Does anyone with manual transmission install experience think this is a possible root cause?
I think I should definitely check fluid level first as it is cheap and much easier to replace. None the less, thoughts of a dry input shaft are stuck in my head.
I tried visualizing this, I think I can see how a dry spline would cause the clutch disc to stick to the flywheel and thus cause the input shaft to continue to rotate (rather than slide away). Does anyone with manual transmission install experience think this is a possible root cause?
I think I should definitely check fluid level first as it is cheap and much easier to replace. None the less, thoughts of a dry input shaft are stuck in my head.
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I doubt that's the problem. It would show up as trouble in shifting in all gears. Also people the gears in all manual transmissions today are meshed. Your only shifting synchros not gears. The grinding you might here is that coming from a synchro's final alignment teeth not meshing correctly for a number of reasons. One being that your master or slave cylinder could be leaking or have air in it and it doesn't function correctly after it warms up. Bleed the entire clutch and master slave cylinders first and also look for any leaks behind the rubber boots of each. That usually fixes most of the problems on that point. If they're good, then you've got some major troubleshooting to do and you will need to take it back to who installed it and have them find the problem. It should be warrantied by them. Good luck.
Al
Al
I doubt that's the problem. It would show up as trouble in shifting in all gears. Also people the gears in all manual transmissions today are meshed. Your only shifting synchros not gears. The grinding you might here is that coming from a synchro's final alignment teeth not meshing correctly for a number of reasons. One being that your master or slave cylinder could be leaking or have air in it and it doesn't function correctly after it warms up. Bleed the entire clutch and master slave cylinders first and also look for any leaks behind the rubber boots of each. That usually fixes most of the problems on that point. If they're good, then you've got some major troubleshooting to do and you will need to take it back to who installed it and have them find the problem. It should be warrantied by them. Good luck.
Al
Al
I was in for an oil change and explained my difficulties getting into first gear to my dealer and asked that they check the transmission fluid level. They said it was fluid level was fine, the linkage was good and suggested it could be internal.
I haven't had too much of the first gear problem since I last updated this thread. The weather has been cool though and this issue arises when it is hot out and the car has been driven for some time.
I decided that I would adjust my clutch engagement to raise engagement and thus give more travel at the bottom of the pedal. This should ensure the clutch is fully disengaged when pressed to the floor and also give more margin should there be air in the system. I still have difficulty shifting out of gear when braking hard. I think I'll see how this goes over the next few weeks or until I get to bleeding the clutch system.
I haven't had too much of the first gear problem since I last updated this thread. The weather has been cool though and this issue arises when it is hot out and the car has been driven for some time.
I decided that I would adjust my clutch engagement to raise engagement and thus give more travel at the bottom of the pedal. This should ensure the clutch is fully disengaged when pressed to the floor and also give more margin should there be air in the system. I still have difficulty shifting out of gear when braking hard. I think I'll see how this goes over the next few weeks or until I get to bleeding the clutch system.
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