I realize that this issue has come up many times in the forum, but it's been a while since I have visited. I have developed persistent shudder, and although I have gone through the procedure of repeated high speed/high force braking exercises, which does help for a short period of time, this issue again comes up quickly. I am not sure about this, but I suspect that I bought the car with Akebono pads, primarily because they produce virtually no brake dust. My rotors, although I have not had a run-out test done, show no visible sign of warping, and very little to no visible wear. My pads are starting to get on the thin side, and I would like to hear opinions on whether or not this thin condition has any impact on the pulsing/shuddering condition that keeps on coming up. My piggy-bank is running thin at the time, and I ask if replacing my pads would be of benefit, as opposed to having the rotor replaced at the same time, realizing that replacing both, done in separate shop visits, would cost me quite a bit more than doing them together. Any opinions would be greatly appreciated.

 

It would help to know how many miles are on your G. Also, when were the pads and rotors last changed?

 

I realized later that this info should have been included, but the only thing I know for sure is the mileage. I bought the car with 55K on it and it currently has 72K. Unfortunately, I have no idea if the pads and rotors are original equipment; and although I do suspect that the pads are Akebono's simply due to the fact that they produce virtually no dust, but have yet to pull them for identification. No squealing or other brake noise has ever occurred, only brake shudder/pulsing. They are however thin enough to be replaced. The rotors as said before have virtually zero visible wear. After a series of 5 or 6 heavy brake applications from 70MPH or so, this problem goes away completely, but only for a short period of time, but what's strange to me is that afterwards, they develop shudder sometimes and sometimes not; I honestly cannot connect to driving conditions except that it is almost always present to a slight degree at the beginning of a drive, but the frequency of this issue overall has been increasing lately.

 

I can only share my experience with my '08 Coupe (w/ Akebonos). I had the same symptoms as you. The brakes would shudder; I would do the heavy braking routine; after a month or so rinse and repeat. Got new pads had rotors turned, same shudder a few months later.

After replacing the rotors and pads (afrermarket) I've not had a issue since and I'm right about 4 years and 10k miles since. If I were a gambling man, I'm sure the assembly line used the cheapest rotors they had but, who knows...

With your current mileage it is likely safe to say the rotors are original to the car. I know money is super tight now, but you should really plan for new pads and rotors.

 

nicaland:

I'm on my third Infiniti since my 2006 G35 6speed manual was purchased in December 2005
I only had to replace brakes once and that was at almost 87k miles on that vehicle. The work was done at my local dealer. That set of brakes and the original rotors were still on the vehicle when I traded it in at almost 177k miles for my 2012 G37S 6speed.That vehicle still had the original pads and rotors at 95k miles when I traded that vehicle in for my current 2016 Q70


I have been happy with the work that my local dealer does.
Shop around but I do not trust any independent shops to touch my car
The prices posted at my local dealer do not seem out of line to me and they do excellent work in my opinion.
Brakes and tires are very important and your life and others depend upon both being in excellent condition.
Just my $.02
Good luck in whatever you decide

 

Thanks ILM-NC G37S. May I ask whose rotors and pads you chose? I have in mind the Akebono ASP1347's, although it's unclear to me if they represent the original equipment exactly or if they are a higher performance design/material.

 

I went overboard/overkill going with DBA T4000 D/S rotors and Hawk HPS 5.0 pads- all in for ≈$850. I do my own labor. Way overboard as my car, nor I, will ever see a track. But, after a few panic stops (god***n tourists) they have paid for themselves and then some.

There are tons of threads about different brake combinations. You just have to sort out what works for your driving style and, more importantly for now your budget.

 

Same. Original 2011 Sport Brakes rotors and pads started this shudder behavior around 40k miles. Performing the bed-in procedure made it go away, so I did that a few times until upgrading both rotors and pads at 46k miles.

OP, I know it hurts to buy new rotors when they look fine, but I suspect you won't entirely get back to a smooth, normal braking behavior until you do.

I'm using those ASP pads from Akebono, and 2-piece Z1 rotors, which are certainly cool hardware, but also overkill. Akebono sport blanks are probably a more sensible choice.

Also, don't listen to people who always and only advise you into dealership-only service. They're just looking to validate their behavior through passive-aggressive influence. It doesn't make them smart, it just makes them annoying.

 

Thanks guys. Sounds like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and go all the way. The car otherwise is just too perfect to put up with this any longer! I'll start perusing posts for economical rotor replacement suggestions....

 

I'd also put in a recommendation for Centric high-carbon rotors. They're relatively cheap, bed in well and are durable at the racetrack. They'll be a good street upgrade.

 

Ceramic pads are famous for doing this. They overheat...hold in the heat...and then smear or deposit themselves on the rotor. And they harden that localized part of the rotor as well.

Expensive rotors won't cure it. The pads will just smear onto your expensive rotors and you'll be back with the shakes. But more expensive.

If you want/need low dust...you're kinda stuck with this condition. Maybe try Powerstop's Z17 or Z23 pads? They seemed to be a very rare circumstance where ceramic pads resisted smearing. But...YMMV.

Here's some rotor Cliff's notes...

What high quality rotors DO buy you is high quality casting that is free of pitting under the surface. And better machining techniques. Example...EBC's rotors are expensive...but their castings are controlled well. Centric rotors are somewhere in between with some acceptable, but unlikely defects. For me...TWO sets of raybestos rotors on two different cars ended up with pits. But hey...they do make the cheapest coated rotors.

Gray cast iron, by definition, has a high carbon content. HighER carbon rotors offer abrasion resistance, and damp out chatter. and to some small extent, *maybe* some resistance to permanent pulsing due to pad smear. If you're using ceramic pads...you're basically rubbing the rotor with a pillow anyway...so you don't need abrasion resistance. And ceramic pads don't audibly chatter. Maybe they'll help with pulsing...maybe...

Cryogenic treated rotors handle repeated heat cycling. They won't crack as easily if you abuse them on a track.

If you get the brake shake...there are two likely reasons...

You warped your rotors..you likely did it mechanically. Like bolting on a wheel too tight or bending the rotor or hub with mechanical stress.

Or your pads got too hot and smeared onto the rotor.

As far as warping your rotors with heat...
You heated up a 35+LB mass of iron to over 2000F, softened it, and your pads were still making friction at that temp, so you developed warping. Maybe use a carbon-strand (non metallic) rotor if you're planning on stopping from 200MPH repeatedly with carbon-strand pads that can create friction at those temps. Your F1 budget should be able to afford the brakes you need.

Without being too cheeky...you will virtually never see a rotor that warped from heat on your street car.

Spend your money on pads.
Instead of buying low dust pads...just avoid brake dust by not looking at your wheels.

Ceramic pads work on an adhesion layer. They trap heat. And they tend to create vibrations.

Metallic pads cut rotors - they work via abrasion. So...they resist smearing. And if they do smear, they cut their own deposits back down.

Hybrid or Organic pads do different things depending on their compound.

All pads have different proprietary mixes. What does "ceramic" mean? What does "semi metallic" mean?

According to Merriam Webster, ceramics ARE part metal and part non metal. So...what metal is in it? Usually iron and AL nowadays....but what type of ceramic substrate?

Same questions on semi metallic pads. What metals are in it? What binder is used?

Are you a scientist? Did you go to science college? No. You just want some gd pads, eh.

Stoptech Sport 309 part number (or Street 308 part number) pads and Centric coated blanks would be my recommendation. Reasonable dust. Resistance to shakes. Bed them in properly. Stop looking at your wheels.

 

Thank you Hugh Jorgens for your extensive comments. I found your response in my junk folder for some reason, hence my late reply. After considerable research, I acknowledge your opinions as true in regards to ceramic pad "smearing" and resulting in pulsation. However, I ended up going with Centric coated blanks and Akebono ASP pads, which, reading between the lines, appear to develop a bit more dust than the standard factory ACT option. As to whether or not I will get more miles out of them as a result of more aggressive rotor wear and less pad deposition and eventual rotor damage, time will tell and I will follow up in this thread with the results. I also spent quite a bit of time researching as to whether or not to aggressively bed-in these pads. Akebono says not to, but several opinions are out there that say that Italian brake tune-ups are still appropriate for these pads. I've decided to stick to Akebono recommendations by avoiding as much as possible excessive heat buildup for a few hundred miles: I'm tracking the car in three weeks, so need to slap this stuff on and get on the road!

 

I've heard good things about the ASP pads - never tried them myself.

You plan to track these, you said? That might be a bit bold...not sure they'll hold up to that. Be safe.

 

So I recently got powerstop z26 rotors and pads here is the good and the bad.

Bad: I got them installed, one was grinding, shady menchainc said it would go away but it didn’t, they wore unevenly and are now apparently warped. I’m unsure who’s fault this is. Powerstop has a clear break in procedure, however, my mechanic told me to mash the brakes a few times so I did, I would find out later that’s not the procedure.

Good: I called powerstop. Said my brakes were jacked up. 2 days later I had new rotors and pads at my door. TWO DAYS.

Best customer service I have ever had and I’m a huge pain in the *** so for me to say that means a lot.

good luck.

 

Well thank you for your concern Mr. Jorgens, but I assure you that no drama is required or expected. I am not installing the ASP's just for track use; this is by far primarily a street car, and will probably only be tracked a few times this coming year. Somehow I suspect that I will muddle through, and as I had previously mentioned, I will be posting my results after some time with this rotor/pad combo. However, if you don't hear back from me here, you can assume that I unfortunately died in a horrible brake failure related crash.