I'm considering buying a car specifically for track use (road race, not drag) so that I can really hone my driving skills in a car that is reliable, handles great, is light, and emphasizes corner speed and smoothness over raw horsepower.

I'm considering a circa 2006/07 s2000 which are priced around $19-23k depending on mileage and condition, or a new Scion FR-s (prefer the less frilly interior along with the chassis tuning vs the BR-Z). These come in around $25k in the basic setup I am looking for.

I've got my own arguments in either direction, but want to see what others think as well. Thanks in advance for your opinions.

 

Not sure if you've read the review of the BRZ posted by forum member "Mike". He owns both an S2K and the BRZ, with a ton of track experience.

Read below:

https://www.myg37.com/forums/other-c...rz-review.html

 

That's very helpful, I will PM him as well. Thank you!

Still open to opinions from others, though

 

dont waste your time asking on this forum....there is like no interest in racing/track here! (very sad!) Hell i dont even know why people waste there time adding performance mods! good luck anyway bro!

 

I'd pick the used s2k because it's cheaper and probably still more direct than the BRZ/FRS.

Especially since this is going to be your dedicated track toy, I'd go with the cheaper and better option, s2k. It doesn't really depreciate in value either.

If it's your daily which you prefer a balance between comfort and performance, then maybe BRZ/FRS.
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Why don't you look into a C5 zo6?? This would be right in your price range and would be killer on the track.

 

While I agree with your reasoning and it is truly a good track car, I'm just not a Vette fan, and its slightly out of my price range if I want one that isn't too beat up on.

Sat in an fr-s today but didn't get to drive it because it was presold but i fit really well in it. The arguments in favor of the s2k are pretty strong though...

 

I voted for the F-RS but then after thinking about it I would probably go with the S2K. It would better to track something used that you wouldn't be as worried about on the track. You go out with a new car and you might find you are on the timid side. I don't know but I am timid in my Z as I would really hate to wreck the car when its only 8 months old.

 

What is/are your goal(s) in tracking the car? List any and all reasons, and I can point you in the right direction

 

Because the LSx is an awesome street motor. They go kaboom on track with sticky tires and a decent driver. Esp the LS7.

Oddly enough, the LS6 tends to be the most reliable... they're usually good for about 30 hours of hard track use.

 

I want a car that behaves the way a car should if you overdrive it, lift mid corner, carry too little entry speed, too much, etc. Want a solid chassis that can take progressive mods over time as my skills and performance in the car improves. Outright power is less important than consistent powerband, for now. Brakes should be well matched to the weight and speed of the vehicle, but i want an upgrade path there too. At the end of the day, fun to drive is of course important.

If you need more info, let me know what aspects you need to hear about.

Thanks!

 

Both cars fit every requirement you have, in some way shape or form.

In stock form, the S2k will rotate upon: overdriving, lifting mid corner, too much gas, abrupt weight shift. The FRS/BRZ will mask all that in stock form; it will either not let the rear out, or when it does, it'll turn into a slide that can be easily recovered. The FRS/BRZ can be a drift car, whereas a s2k simply will not hold (real) drifts.

The BRZ/FRS's brakes are more than suited to the stock power level. The S2k's is a bit lacking (most people, myself included, compensate by using extremely aggressive pads, which has its own set of problems). Both cars have BBK ugprade paths. Both cars suck to get wheels for. Both cars are extremely limited in wheel choice if you want to fit a BBK.

What kind of mods do you plan on doing (with a rough timeframe for them)? How much power do you eventually want? What exactly do you want to learn when it comes to driving (specific skills, situations, etc)?

Both cars are fun to drive in their own way, and both are far more fun than a vette/evo/sti/z.

 

First, thanks for the reply and the experienced information. Will respond in kind below.

I think I'm ok with a more twitchy chassis, though it's not preferred. I have no interest in "drift racing" but if a powerslide happens here or there, I'm not miffed. Just not ever going to truly drift the car- not my thing.


I obviously would prefer a better brake setup, but I've been reading about the honda accord caliper conversion on the front for hte s2k, and that the car is brake biased to the rear from the factory. Would probably do this mod with racingbrake rotors, pads, and lines. That should suffice, right? Maybe brake ducts as a later upgrade path.

How does the BRZ brake pedal feel? Stiffer or softer than s2k? More or less bite (with the same pads, of course)?


Mods - I like modding as my famliarity and experience improve, so I can both feel and benefit from the change. I don't generally do the big bang approach since it then becomes hard to attribute improvements (or detriments) to specific changes. Not necessarily in order, I'm thinking: fluids tires and brakes, suspension with geometry fixes if needed, intake/exhaust, additional cooling to engine and drivetrain, forced induction if I want it and only after I find that I'm truly limited by power.

Nice Thanks again

 

If you want to learn to drive grip, and focus solely on that, then get the S2k. The S2k forces you to learn how to drive grip, because any slide will become either a HUGE loss in speed or a spin. It punishes the rear coming out so severely that you'll learn to keep the rear in check in lightning quick fashion (hopefully you won't become one of those guys that sets up an understeering s2k because it's "safer"; looser is faster when it comes to driving). The BRZ/FRS will hold a slide without really punishing you, so unless you're logging data, and/or are shooting video AND have someone that can analyze it or teach you to analyze it, you won't realize how much time you're losing by sliding.

IMO, the accord caliper conversion on the S2k is not worth it. Everyone that has tried it, IMO, is not a particularly fast driver. These are guys who run XP10/XP8 with no fade issues on R-comps and slicks. All the fast guys I know in person are always fighting brake fade with higher temp pads. If you go BBK, you need to decide if you go front only, or front + rear. Brake bias can be changed and/or compensated for with compound choice. Pedal in the two cars is the same when new, but the S2k is more prone to boiling fluid, and once you boil it, the pedal never quite feels the same again in the s2k. I haven't boiled the BRZ yet, but I also went straight to top shelf stuff to avoid that (Ferodo SRF is around $30/500mL).

The BRZ will respond better to mods, because the S2k is better built/tuned from the factory. Both cars will gain very little power from bolt-ons, but both cars will also lose weight from bolt-ons. In the case of my s2k, I gained about 10hp from a headerback exhaust + tune, but I also lost 60lbs. 10hp is very little, but when you factor in the 60lb weight reduction, my total power/weight ratio changed 11%, which is quite significant.

 

Awesome info- much to digest. Thanks and I might follow up with more questions via PM if that's ok...

I'm stoked- I was doing some research on s2000 prep and found a site that mentioned a semi-local track I didn't even know existed (I just moved to VA from CA), and I just registered for a track day in November! Will give me time to figure out what to do, and if I don't by then I'll just prep and take the G while I mull things over.

Stoked.