Don't Use Nissan OEM Oil Filters (Long Post - Lotsa Pics)
11-24-2007, 09:49 PM
#46
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I've worked on aircraft engines for 20 years, turbine and reciprocating, and I've seen some real "head scratchers"...I like to use manufacturer/OEM parts, as much as I can, especially with the engine. I have four other vehicles that I've always used certain OEM parts, such as: oil filters, fuel filters, spark plugs, timing belts, radiator hoses, water pumps, alternator, cap & rotor, etc.. two of the vehicles I bought new in 1991, the wife's '03 mini-van, and my '04 "work" truck.. my teenagers are now driving the two 1991 vehicles. I've had great luck with OEM parts keeping my vehicles running without any problems. Maybe after-market parts might have done the same, I don't know..but I choose to go with OEM. The battery is probably the only thing that isn't OEM.
Last edited by Romeo Xray; 11-24-2007 at 10:30 PM.
11-29-2007, 09:33 AM
#48
I e-mailed Purolator and asked them. They referred me to their FAQ's. I guess this must be a popular question. Here's their FAQ:
Q / "I have an oil filter from you already but need one a little (shorter, taller, thicker, thinner) to fit better in the alotted engine space OR I want a bigger oil filter can so I can maximize my filtration potential?"
A / We ONLY recommend the OEM replacement part number for your specific vehicle. Any use of a filter not on our OEM recommended list will void the warranty we provide for our filters. Our filters are built for each specific vehicle. Even if the oil can looks the same or is the same thread length it doesn't mean it will fit the application you are trying to use it on. Any custom oil conversion kits or relocater kits should have a filter size recommendation on the instruction sheet. Use that number to then find a cross-reference to our part number.
It looks like you must use Purolator's recommended filter number to keep their warranty (if Infiniti denies coverage because you used a Purolator filter, Purolator will step up) in effect. Just sort of a head's up FYI.
P.S. I also learned Purolator is a joint venture between Bosch and Mann, both of whom make good oil filter under their own names in Europe. Mann is a Porsche OEM oil filter supplier. Their standards are among the highest in the industry.
01-28-2008, 01:33 AM
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I have about 750 miles on my G37 now and I was thinking of changing the oil for the first time. I've always wondered what an OEM filter looked like inside. I had some free time today and decided to find out.
I visited my local dealer today and bought myself a 15208-65F0C, the stock-sized filter specified for a 2008 G37. The guy at the counter said it's the same filter used for the G35. It costs about $7/ea.
I had an extra Purolator oil filter at home. It costs about $3 (sometimes $0.01 after rebate) and is readily available at PepBoys.
NOTE: The Purolator oil filter I used is L14610. It's the longer version of the L14612 which is listed on the Purolator website as the oil filter for G37s.
Here's some pics:
Nissan OEM oil filter
Purolator oil filter
The Purolator filter is larger than the OEM filter
Now it's time to cut these open! Prepare to be shocked and disappointed.
NOTE: For those of you who've read about oil filters, you probably know that Fram has the worst reputation amongst widely available oil filters. They tend to have flimsy cans and, most disturbingly, their filter elements are made with weak cardboard end caps that can collapse or fragment in hot oil. Good filters, like Mobil 1, Purolator PureONE, and K&N are made with heavy metal "skeletons" that will neither collapse nor break down in hot oil.
OEM filter bottom
OEM filter cut open (I immediately noticed the cardboard endpiece)
Everything inside the OEM filter laid out
Close up of the OEM filter's cardboard endpiece
Time to open up the Purolator
Purolator filter bottom
Purolator filter cut open (Metal endpieces)
Everything inside the Purolator filter laid out
Close up of the Purolator's metal endpiece
Side-by-side comparo of both filters (Purolator on the left, OEM on the right). The Purolator filter element is approx 2 1/2" tall with 50 pleats vs the OEM filter element which is approx 1 7/8" tall with only 41 pleats. More pleat area = better filtering ability.
Filter top
Filter bottom
Anti-drainback valve (Purolator is made with a thicker, better quality rubber. OEM was thinner and felt flimsy)
Bypass valve
So what did I learn from all this? Pretty simple... the OEM oil filter is basically a Fram in disguise. Will I ever use one in my G37? Probably not.
Also note that the Purolator filter that I used was the PremiumPLUS filter. Purolator also makes their top oil filters called PureONE, which costs more ($5-$6). The PureONE filters are even better than the PremiumPLUS Purolators. I'll try and open one of those too when I get a chance.
So what's the best oil filter to use in our cars? You can't go wrong with any of these:
Purolator PureONE
Mobil 1
AMSOil
Bosch
K&N
Napa Gold
If you wanna save some money and do regular oil change intervals, any of these oil filters will suffice. Hell, anything's better than a Fram/OEM Nissan oil filter.
Purolator PremiumPLUS
SuperTech
STP
AC Delco
Valucraft (Autozone brand)
I've heard good things about the $2 SuperTech oil filters at Wal-Mart. That may be another viable option. I gotta read up some more and maybe cut one open. I plan on doing my first oil change in a couple of days.
Anyway, hope this post was informative for you guys.
Happy motoring!
I visited my local dealer today and bought myself a 15208-65F0C, the stock-sized filter specified for a 2008 G37. The guy at the counter said it's the same filter used for the G35. It costs about $7/ea.
I had an extra Purolator oil filter at home. It costs about $3 (sometimes $0.01 after rebate) and is readily available at PepBoys.
NOTE: The Purolator oil filter I used is L14610. It's the longer version of the L14612 which is listed on the Purolator website as the oil filter for G37s.
Here's some pics:
Nissan OEM oil filter
Purolator oil filter
The Purolator filter is larger than the OEM filter
Now it's time to cut these open! Prepare to be shocked and disappointed.
NOTE: For those of you who've read about oil filters, you probably know that Fram has the worst reputation amongst widely available oil filters. They tend to have flimsy cans and, most disturbingly, their filter elements are made with weak cardboard end caps that can collapse or fragment in hot oil. Good filters, like Mobil 1, Purolator PureONE, and K&N are made with heavy metal "skeletons" that will neither collapse nor break down in hot oil.
OEM filter bottom
OEM filter cut open (I immediately noticed the cardboard endpiece)
Everything inside the OEM filter laid out
Close up of the OEM filter's cardboard endpiece
Time to open up the Purolator
Purolator filter bottom
Purolator filter cut open (Metal endpieces)
Everything inside the Purolator filter laid out
Close up of the Purolator's metal endpiece
Side-by-side comparo of both filters (Purolator on the left, OEM on the right). The Purolator filter element is approx 2 1/2" tall with 50 pleats vs the OEM filter element which is approx 1 7/8" tall with only 41 pleats. More pleat area = better filtering ability.
Filter top
Filter bottom
Anti-drainback valve (Purolator is made with a thicker, better quality rubber. OEM was thinner and felt flimsy)
Bypass valve
So what did I learn from all this? Pretty simple... the OEM oil filter is basically a Fram in disguise. Will I ever use one in my G37? Probably not.
Also note that the Purolator filter that I used was the PremiumPLUS filter. Purolator also makes their top oil filters called PureONE, which costs more ($5-$6). The PureONE filters are even better than the PremiumPLUS Purolators. I'll try and open one of those too when I get a chance.
So what's the best oil filter to use in our cars? You can't go wrong with any of these:
Purolator PureONE
Mobil 1
AMSOil
Bosch
K&N
Napa Gold
If you wanna save some money and do regular oil change intervals, any of these oil filters will suffice. Hell, anything's better than a Fram/OEM Nissan oil filter.
Purolator PremiumPLUS
SuperTech
STP
AC Delco
Valucraft (Autozone brand)
I've heard good things about the $2 SuperTech oil filters at Wal-Mart. That may be another viable option. I gotta read up some more and maybe cut one open. I plan on doing my first oil change in a couple of days.
Anyway, hope this post was informative for you guys.
Happy motoring!
I am not going to debate or try and debunk your posting info here, but I will share my view on this matter with you. Having owned My TT 300 ZX for some time and been very involved in all technical aspects of the car, I have learned ALOT about NIssan engines and related parts.
This subject was debated and experimented with in the Z community for several years. When it came down to it, the general consensus was that the Nissan filter was the best. Now, later on Nissan switched our filter with one that was used on a few cars and we could tell the difference, so many stocked up on the old Nissan (Nippon) filters or saught better alternatives.
One you thing you have to keep in mind when evaluating the effectiveness of the filter is flow. It's great that others have more pleats or taller filters, but keep in mind that the engine lubricating system is designed so that oil is dispersed through the oil filter, pick up, through the oil galleys into the heads and all around the crankshaft, rod, main bearings etc. If you have a filter that has more dense filtration or a longer channel of filtration, this could theoretically inhibit flow and distribution of the oil throughout the engine.
I know one might argue that that little bit won't make a difference, but a little bit of minute extra wear on each cycle of oil lubrication could add up and lead to distressed parts. Quicker degradation of rod bearings or main journal bearings. When engineers design engines, they painstakingly calculate and try and calculate more.
It might be negligible and then maybe it's not. After having been through years of other Z'ers building up their engines and me building up my engines, one thing was evident.....Nissan OEM parts, for the most part, were the best choices of replacement, unless going for some unique after market piece. Nissan specs are tighter than most company's specs and I have had a few engine builders tell me that they think it's a joke, to only see their engines fail in some manner. If this were Ford/Mopar etc then I would say screw them as their tolerances are not as narrow, as is the case with most domestics, but with Japanese and Nissan in particular, stick with the OEM since it has been engineered around the engine. Just my .02 cents!
01-28-2008, 02:09 AM
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One trick I have always used was to put a strong magnet on the bottom of your oil pan so as not to allow any possible metal shavings to be possibly redistributed back through the engine. Don't think I would do it with this car, but when your talking about highly modded, FI cars, it's always better to err on the side of caution!
01-28-2008, 02:51 AM
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01-28-2008, 03:17 AM
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^^^^ I am too my 87 sentra had a strong magnet in the bottom of the oil pan. I know htis because I saw it when i replaced the oil pan after smashing it on a dirt road. I do agree with you and not worry about it on this engin just asking the question if anyone knowes if we have this or not.
01-28-2008, 06:47 AM
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This thread is hilarious and so typical of how little people know about oil, filters, warranties, and cars in general.
There is no waiting period for using synthetic oil. Not even 100 miles. You do know that MB, BMW, Porsche and Corvettes come with synthetic oil as the initial factory fill.
The advantage of using synthetics are very high temperature stability and long service life. For turbos a must. Otherwise, not much use unless you extend the drain intervals. While under warranty almost all service schedules allow for 7500 miles. I use synthetic, change every 7500 miles till the warranty is over then once a year thereafter. If you still believe in 3000 mile oil changes save your money and use conventional oil.
There is nothing magic at about an OEM filter. Nissan doesn't make make filters, the have a filter maker package them as Nissan filters. I agree it sure looks like a Fram. I wouldn't leave those cardboard filters in my car for a year with synthetic oil.
You CANNOT be denied warranty service for using an after market filter. Period.
If you change your oil and filter on schedule (3-5000 miles conventional oil, 7-15000 miles synthetic oil), you will never have a lubrication related failure anyway. It is almost unheard of.
There is no waiting period for using synthetic oil. Not even 100 miles. You do know that MB, BMW, Porsche and Corvettes come with synthetic oil as the initial factory fill.
The advantage of using synthetics are very high temperature stability and long service life. For turbos a must. Otherwise, not much use unless you extend the drain intervals. While under warranty almost all service schedules allow for 7500 miles. I use synthetic, change every 7500 miles till the warranty is over then once a year thereafter. If you still believe in 3000 mile oil changes save your money and use conventional oil.
There is nothing magic at about an OEM filter. Nissan doesn't make make filters, the have a filter maker package them as Nissan filters. I agree it sure looks like a Fram. I wouldn't leave those cardboard filters in my car for a year with synthetic oil.
You CANNOT be denied warranty service for using an after market filter. Period.
If you change your oil and filter on schedule (3-5000 miles conventional oil, 7-15000 miles synthetic oil), you will never have a lubrication related failure anyway. It is almost unheard of.
Last edited by todd92; 01-28-2008 at 10:24 AM.
01-28-2008, 10:48 AM
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This thread is hilarious and so typical of how little people know about oil, filters, warranties, and cars in general.
There is no waiting period for using synthetic oil. Not even 100 miles. You do know that MB, BMW, Porsche and Corvettes come with synthetic oil as the initial factory fill.
The advantage of using synthetics are very high temperature stability and long service life. For turbos a must. Otherwise, not much use unless you extend the drain intervals. While under warranty almost all service schedules allow for 7500 miles. I use synthetic, change every 7500 miles till the warranty is over then once a year thereafter. If you still believe in 3000 mile oil changes save your money and use conventional oil.
There is nothing magic at about an OEM filter. Nissan doesn't make make filters, the have a filter maker package them as Nissan filters. I agree it sure looks like a Fram. I wouldn't leave those cardboard filters in my car for a year with synthetic oil.
You CANNOT be denied warranty service for using an after market filter. Period.
If you change your oil and filter on schedule (3-5000 miles conventional oil, 7-15000 miles synthetic oil), you will never have a lubrication related failure anyway. It is almost unheard of.
There is no waiting period for using synthetic oil. Not even 100 miles. You do know that MB, BMW, Porsche and Corvettes come with synthetic oil as the initial factory fill.
The advantage of using synthetics are very high temperature stability and long service life. For turbos a must. Otherwise, not much use unless you extend the drain intervals. While under warranty almost all service schedules allow for 7500 miles. I use synthetic, change every 7500 miles till the warranty is over then once a year thereafter. If you still believe in 3000 mile oil changes save your money and use conventional oil.
There is nothing magic at about an OEM filter. Nissan doesn't make make filters, the have a filter maker package them as Nissan filters. I agree it sure looks like a Fram. I wouldn't leave those cardboard filters in my car for a year with synthetic oil.
You CANNOT be denied warranty service for using an after market filter. Period.
If you change your oil and filter on schedule (3-5000 miles conventional oil, 7-15000 miles synthetic oil), you will never have a lubrication related failure anyway. It is almost unheard of.
I did not state anything about warranty as I know you can't be denied, but what happens when you have excessive wear or problems AFTER your warranty is up?
We know, as with most major corporations, that Nissan does not make their own filters, but they did set specific parameters for the filter they wanted to be implemented for use with their engine. If you think engineers just come out with these things like farts out of your azz, then you really shouldn't even be giving advice or feedback on a car forum.
BTW, synthetic is NOT A MUST for turbo'd cars. The only significance synthetic oil has on turbos is more resistance to oil coking on the bearings of the center housing rotating assembly. People have been running turbos for many years before synthetic came out, so please inform correctly or at least with some knowledge, if your going to at all.
01-28-2008, 11:12 AM
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I think you have no idea what your talking about. Engines from major manufacturers, MB, Porsche, Chevy, BMW are broken in initially with dyno oil. This is NOT a synthetic blend and you obviously have never rebuilt an engine nor know about what happens during an initial break in period. As I said before, car engines are broken in at the plant and 90% of the break-in occurs within the first 20 min. If you knew anything, most high end or high performance cars are run significantly prior to being distributed. If you would like to know the particular time and methods, maybe you should extrapolate that data so you can then form an opinion.
I did not state anything about warranty as I know you can't be denied, but what happens when you have excessive wear or problems AFTER your warranty is up?
We know, as with most major corporations, that Nissan does not make their own filters, but they did set specific parameters for the filter they wanted to be implemented for use with their engine. If you think engineers just come out with these things like farts out of your azz, then you really shouldn't even be giving advice or feedback on a car forum.
BTW, synthetic is NOT A MUST for turbo'd cars. The only significance synthetic oil has on turbos is more resistance to oil coking on the bearings of the center housing rotating assembly. People have been running turbos for many years before synthetic came out, so please inform correctly or at least with some knowledge, if your going to at all.
I did not state anything about warranty as I know you can't be denied, but what happens when you have excessive wear or problems AFTER your warranty is up?
We know, as with most major corporations, that Nissan does not make their own filters, but they did set specific parameters for the filter they wanted to be implemented for use with their engine. If you think engineers just come out with these things like farts out of your azz, then you really shouldn't even be giving advice or feedback on a car forum.
BTW, synthetic is NOT A MUST for turbo'd cars. The only significance synthetic oil has on turbos is more resistance to oil coking on the bearings of the center housing rotating assembly. People have been running turbos for many years before synthetic came out, so please inform correctly or at least with some knowledge, if your going to at all.
Use a quality oil, change it on schedule, you will have no wear or problems before or after the warranty.
You seem to think engineers spend a lot of time designing oil filter specs. Oil filters have been around forever, there isn't much new to design. Your implication that after market filters may lead to engine wear is baseless and wrong.
Yes, the issue with turbos is oil coking in the turbo bearing. Synthetic is not required, but is really prudent, since it is highly resistant to that coking.
My background includes developing Mobil 1 at Mobil's R&D facilities. Years of testing oil in engines on dynos and in the field. Sorry to burst your bubble.
01-28-2008, 10:03 PM
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I said the initial factory fill on those cars is synthetic. I know about engine break-in, I race motorcycles and rebuild and break-in engines all the time. You are right, it takes 20-30 minutes to break-in an engine. So there is no waiting time to switch to synthetic, which is the only point I made in that statement.
Use a quality oil, change it on schedule, you will have no wear or problems before or after the warranty.
You seem to think engineers spend a lot of time designing oil filter specs. Oil filters have been around forever, there isn't much new to design. Your implication that after market filters may lead to engine wear is baseless and wrong.
Yes, the issue with turbos is oil coking in the turbo bearing. Synthetic is not required, but is really prudent, since it is highly resistant to that coking.
My background includes developing Mobil 1 at Mobil's R&D facilities. Years of testing oil in engines on dynos and in the field. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Use a quality oil, change it on schedule, you will have no wear or problems before or after the warranty.
You seem to think engineers spend a lot of time designing oil filter specs. Oil filters have been around forever, there isn't much new to design. Your implication that after market filters may lead to engine wear is baseless and wrong.
Yes, the issue with turbos is oil coking in the turbo bearing. Synthetic is not required, but is really prudent, since it is highly resistant to that coking.
My background includes developing Mobil 1 at Mobil's R&D facilities. Years of testing oil in engines on dynos and in the field. Sorry to burst your bubble.
01-28-2008, 10:54 PM
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time-out.
all this cutting open the oil filter is great, but did anyone test to see which filter actually filters out the crap in the motor oil ?
sure oem may be cradboard, but the weave of the filter itself might be faaaar superior in trapping micro-particulates... is that not the sole purpose of the filter ?
many folds = efficiency, what what is efficiency if the particles merely re-circulate ?
.
i am not trying to start another fight, i just hope someone can have some solid objective data to backup these oil filters.
all this cutting open the oil filter is great, but did anyone test to see which filter actually filters out the crap in the motor oil ?
sure oem may be cradboard, but the weave of the filter itself might be faaaar superior in trapping micro-particulates... is that not the sole purpose of the filter ?
many folds = efficiency, what what is efficiency if the particles merely re-circulate ?
.
i am not trying to start another fight, i just hope someone can have some solid objective data to backup these oil filters.