15951

Hi John. I know what you're saying, but pretty much every single thing they do is to make money. Most dealers are service departments that happen to sell cars, not the other way around. They're making a sick profit on those filters, and then charging $5 for about 2 minutes of labor, tops.

The manual calls for new air filters at 30k miles.


You pre-paid for 20 oil changes and new coolant at 60k miles. If you're not driving an S, then you also get pre-paid tire rotations.

The first oil change is free at most dealers, so that drops to you 19. They're going to be using bulk oil, ester oil will cost extra. They will also try to hammer you on engine and cabin air filters, so figure those in at 30k and 15k, respectively.

They're charging you $50 for each of 19 oil changes, and around $150 for the coolant drain/fill. Don't even entertain the idea that they're going to do anything more than that. The bean counters are also hoping that you sell the car before 5 years, so they can pocket the difference - most people won't go to bat for the difference. If you do get anything back, the pro rata share will be less $50 or so for "processing". It's all there in the agreement.

You also just guaranteed the dealer your business for service. You no longer even have the option to use anyone else.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

7500 is just fine, if your driving is 80%+ highway. If you do any short trips to the store and around town, that is considered "severe".

Remember, the vast vast majority of your engine wear occurs right after startup. Once the engine and all the fluids are up to operating temperature, there's very little wear going on.

SkyMG37x

You're right - for some reason I thought it was 15K but noticed that's only for the Premium schedule which is generally overkill. However I feel 30K is too long for air filter changes and will do them myself earlier. It's a simple and low cost way to keep the engine running well.

Also the plan does cover Ester oil changes so that alone will cover the cost of the plan.

eauty

John, where in your plan does it state "Ester"oil will be used on oil changes? Those contracts, in which I have one, seem fairly generic and I'm not sure I saw oil type or quality spelled out anywhere. Thanks

SkyMG37x

I discussed the plan with my service advisor and he confirmed that Ester is covered under the maintenance plan.

movinon

You are not considered to be in the severe category by just taking short trips, to the store or around town, if that was the case, every owner would fall into the severe category.
The manual states:
"If you primarily ( the key word being primarily) operate your vehicle under any of these conditions:

Repeated short trips of less then 5 miles in normal temperatures or less then 10 miles in freezing temperatures.

Stop and go traffic in hot weather or low speed driving for long distances.

Driving in dusty conditions or on rough, muddy or salt-spread roads.

Towing a trailer, or using a camper or car-top carrier.

When you are reading these 4 conditions remember to put the word "PRIMARILY" in front of each.
Vehicles that do fall under these conditions are police cars, taxicabs, mail delivery, meter readers, etc.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

I think you misunderstood.

Police cars, taxicabs, mail trucks, and meter reader cars are left running. They are always at operating temperature.

What Infiniti (and every other car manufacturer) is getting at, is that the car is not getting up to full operating temperature, or going above normal operating temperature.

movinon

Since we are debating this, I will bring up another issue.
One of the things that puts extra wear on an engine is start up, directly after doing an oil change, especially when the oil filter is not pre-filled.
As an example: Owner A keeps a car for 100,000 miles and changes oil every 7,500 miles; versus owner B that changes oil every 3,500 miles in 100,000 miles ( when the driving conditions do not really warrant it).
Owner B has changed his oil 13 times more then owner A.
Each of these extra oil changes puts unnecessary start up wear on the engine, until the new oil begins fully circulating.
I realize that this sounds ridicules, but it is factual.
The dealerships of all makes try and convince their customers to adhere to the severe schedule, since that is where they make their profit.
The only car I can recall that the dealership didn't want me to use the severe schedule was BMW. I had a 540i and didn't get it changed but every 11,000 miles or so. It had lit bars on the instrument panel that would go out as it came closer for the oil to be changed.
The computer would factor in what conditions the car was operating under and adjust the oil schedule to it.
Most of my cars I change oil myself, but the BMW needed a special tool to reset the maintenance schedule back to zero.
Then of course there is the problem that when anyone works on your car, there is a chance that they will screw something up.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

So, you're telling me the dealer is making a killing on a 45 dollar oil change?

Lets say, dealer's cost on bulk oil is $10, filter $5. Tech's time for 1/2 hour: $15, Service Advisor's commission: $5.


Pre-filling the oil filter, when its at the end of the oil flow path, is not going change the wear on your engine.

movinon

They can usually talk a certain percentage of the customers into other services while they are getting their oil changed.

I have been into cars for many years and have never heard someone state that you shouldn't pre-fill the oil filter.

15951

Dealer service departments aren't charities. They exist only to make money. Nothing wrong with that, but it's silly to pretend otherwise, or imply that they're philanthropists that are on a mission to keep Infinitis in top running shape.

I think your estimates are very generous. They're buying oil in huge quantities, and you can be sure that bulk oil is purchased cheap. Same goes with the filter. The tech that changes oil is not the same guy that troubleshoots major issues...he's typically an oil/lube/filter guy, and that's it. Do you really think he's getting paid $30/hour for that, even accounting for benefits?

Oil changes make steady money, but like was stated previously, the real reason for by-the-book service is to upsell you on other items.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

I guess for the newer guys, I should state my qualifications.

I used to work at Riverside Infiniti. The techs actually do make more than 30/hr, and no, there are no techs at Riverside Infiniti that only do lube; every single one of them is capable of tearing your car apart and rebuilding it from the ground up. You'd be shocked if you knew how many replacement/rebuilt engines I've seen go through the dealership during my time there.

Additionally, although this is not the case for all dealerships, Riverside Infiniti uses a synthetic blend oil for their 'standard' oil changes; Motul/Eneos/Nissan Ester, you just pay the difference. Service Advisors do not push product or services. Instead, they look for potential warranty work that they can bill Infiniti for.

Riverside, is of course, the exception. Most services are purchased a la carte there. There are hundreds of so-cal members here, who will drive the extra 50-100 miles, to get their cars serviced there. Yes, the alignment rack there will take lowered cars.


No, dealer service depts. are not charities. That's why you purchase service a la carte, based on your needs.

15951

Thanks for the explanation, Mike. Sounds like you worked for an unusual dealership, to say the least!

Why didn't they choose to keep cheaper guys on the payroll for oil changes? Seems like a horrible waste of talent to have a guy doing oil changes that can rebuild an engine.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

That's not my decision to make, but the more experienced guys tend to do EVERYTHING better, and more efficient.

More importantly, they don't make mistakes. You do get what you pay for, in the case of hiring techs, some of which are master techs.

Mrgthing

I love that last line! They got me @ 15K with the $400 oil change, smiled and said "see ya @ 30K" handed me the service list with a quote of $895. I called nissan and they wanted $600 for the same service. but after reading your posts none a them hoes are gettin' my doe! I am gonna take it to midas for the oil, look everything over, change my wipers and filters at autozone, then bring it to Infiniti and have them warranty that squeeky-*** brakes! Then when they remind me of my 30K I will smile and say maybe if you charged $200 maybe even splurge @ $300 but $900??? kiss my freakn' bumper, I will have a 50 in big screen in the back before I pay that.
"Now get on your knees and warranty that rattly-*** muffler!"